WEBVTT 00:00:09.200 --> 00:00:21.135 I'm father Charles Sikorsky, president of Weimar University, and I'm really blessed to be joined here today by doctor Bob Schutte, who is the founder and director of the John Paul the second Yealink Center. 00:00:22.075 --> 00:00:24.715 And welcome, and thank you so much for taking time to be with us. 00:00:24.715 --> 00:00:24.875 Yeah. 00:00:24.875 --> 00:00:25.775 Thank you, Charles. 00:00:25.835 --> 00:00:26.715 It's really good. 00:00:26.715 --> 00:00:28.555 I love the work that you guys are doing. 00:00:28.555 --> 00:00:29.115 Well, thank you. 00:00:29.115 --> 00:00:30.555 And we admire what you do. 00:00:30.555 --> 00:00:37.170 And and maybe you could give us a little bit about your, your background and and how you ended up where you are today. 00:00:37.170 --> 00:00:37.670 Okay. 00:00:37.970 --> 00:00:38.290 Yeah. 00:00:38.290 --> 00:00:41.810 I I got my, I'll just start at the point of my degree. 00:00:41.810 --> 00:00:48.515 I got a psychology degree at Columbia and then master's and doctorate at Florida State. 00:00:48.515 --> 00:01:07.200 So it was a secular degree, but I had two Catholic friends that went through all my doctorate program with us and so it was a great opportunity to start to integrate, and yet there is still something really missing in terms of the foundation, which is what I love about what you guys are doing. 00:01:07.200 --> 00:01:07.680 Yeah. 00:01:07.680 --> 00:01:21.785 And, I I went into counseling and then I I started to run into my own, healing after I was a therapist and teacher and I was teaching, college programs. 00:01:22.165 --> 00:01:30.200 And that drove me both into therapy for the first time and also to a renewal, spiritual renewal. 00:01:30.820 --> 00:01:44.495 And it was the combination of those two things that the doing the work in therapy and the spiritual renewal that all of a sudden, they came together in a way that up before that, it was more here. 00:01:45.115 --> 00:01:50.895 And as that like, it spiritually became real, like, the the intimacy. 00:01:51.730 --> 00:02:05.585 And from that point on, I really developed a hunger to integrate and that's what we do now at John Paul the second healing center is this this integration of the psychological world with the Catholic faith and John Paul the second. 00:02:05.585 --> 00:02:06.465 You know, you mentioned that. 00:02:06.465 --> 00:02:24.890 I I one of the things that I shouldn't have been surprised by, but it did surprise me over the years working here at DMU, is some of our graduates saying, I feel perfectly prepared for my career and I loved everything I learned, but I ended up learning more about myself in studying this field. 00:02:24.890 --> 00:02:35.085 And and I think people will hear that when you study counseling or psychology or even our spiritual director, you have to think that there's less self reflection that goes into it and Yeah. 00:02:35.645 --> 00:02:41.665 You know, you can really hopefully, it'll be your experience that really helps you go on further. 00:02:41.725 --> 00:02:42.045 Yeah. 00:02:42.045 --> 00:02:43.485 It it shakes you up at first. 00:02:43.485 --> 00:02:43.985 Yeah. 00:02:44.390 --> 00:02:47.510 So then you practice for a while and then Of thirty five years. 00:02:47.510 --> 00:02:48.810 Thirty thirty five years. 00:02:49.030 --> 00:02:49.910 That's a long time. 00:02:49.910 --> 00:02:52.870 And then you decided to stop that and and Yeah. 00:02:52.870 --> 00:02:55.430 I mean shifted to the Hatcherty too. 00:02:55.510 --> 00:02:56.950 Decide is probably too strong. 00:02:56.950 --> 00:03:06.135 I eventually decided, but I started working with priests and seminarians way back while I was still a therapist. 00:03:06.435 --> 00:03:15.530 Then I was doing marriage conferences and men's conferences and all of those things developed such a momentum, and the Theology of the Body Institute, I was working up there. 00:03:15.990 --> 00:03:26.810 And so it all just kinda came together and it I couldn't do my therapy work anymore because this was just really growing and so that's when John Paul the second healing center started. 00:03:27.025 --> 00:03:29.685 And what was it that made you see the need for that? 00:03:31.585 --> 00:03:37.685 Well, the need was just so apparent in every every every group. 00:03:38.385 --> 00:03:47.460 It was like people just needed permission to have that integration and they needed permission they needed a language. 00:03:48.160 --> 00:03:56.675 And so, you know, the language of the church and the language of the experience as a therapist and a teacher just came together like aren't you? 00:03:56.675 --> 00:03:57.175 Yeah. 00:03:58.195 --> 00:04:03.075 But tell us a little bit about what what the John Paul two Healing Center does. 00:04:03.075 --> 00:04:16.230 I know I've heard many great things from from priest who've gone through the the different retreats, but you also do a lot for lay people and, I suppose are they all Catholic or are people with the spiritual life or others? 00:04:16.290 --> 00:04:17.410 Mostly Catholic. 00:04:17.410 --> 00:04:24.295 We get a portion of people who are other Christian denominations or people who are searching. 00:04:24.675 --> 00:04:27.475 But we have a bishop's retreat once a year. 00:04:27.475 --> 00:04:29.175 That's been beautiful and powerful. 00:04:29.795 --> 00:04:33.655 We have three retreats for religious women. 00:04:34.200 --> 00:04:38.140 One for superiors, one for leaders, and one for sisters. 00:04:39.720 --> 00:04:49.955 We we have, we just had, twelve years of seminary and a month long retreat and now we work with the formators in the seminary. 00:04:51.615 --> 00:05:05.220 We have a thing for married couples, a thing for the general population called healing no person, podcasts, restoring the glory, and then we have a men's conference and a women's conference. 00:05:05.280 --> 00:05:06.120 So Okay. 00:05:06.320 --> 00:05:08.740 We're kind of a whole you're busy, the whole church. 00:05:09.520 --> 00:05:20.335 And when you talk about the healing center, can you tell us a little bit of what what are the aspects that need to be healed and how like, the you have the we're incarnational beings. 00:05:20.335 --> 00:05:21.295 There's a human part. 00:05:21.295 --> 00:05:25.695 There's a spiritual part that's, that's just the truth. 00:05:25.695 --> 00:05:31.610 It's just reality and so much of, you know, secular psychology kinda reduces the gist of a human. 00:05:32.230 --> 00:05:35.190 And sometimes you can over spiritualize it as well. 00:05:35.190 --> 00:05:35.830 You know? 00:05:35.830 --> 00:05:37.430 How do you go about that? 00:05:37.430 --> 00:05:40.485 And maybe in your experience, like, what yeah. 00:05:40.725 --> 00:05:47.765 I I think because of my own experience of integrating that, it just naturally gets expressed in everything. 00:05:47.765 --> 00:05:49.465 It's just seeing it together. 00:05:50.325 --> 00:05:54.505 So we talk about the effect of sin is wounds. 00:05:54.805 --> 00:05:57.280 So we talk about the seven deadly sins Mhmm. 00:05:57.440 --> 00:05:58.980 And the seven deadly wounds. 00:05:59.760 --> 00:06:05.160 And that if we only deal with the sin like in confession Mhmm. 00:06:05.280 --> 00:06:10.260 And we're not attending to the wounds, the wounds become the festering ground for the sins. 00:06:10.735 --> 00:06:11.055 Yeah. 00:06:11.055 --> 00:06:24.575 And and so we wanna address both of them but we wanna address them not in a secular sense but with the understanding of science but also with the understanding of the Holy Spirit and how the teaching of the church. 00:06:24.575 --> 00:06:29.300 And John Paul the second's teaching kind of like GMU comes just through everything. 00:06:29.600 --> 00:06:30.160 Well, yeah. 00:06:30.160 --> 00:06:30.400 Yeah. 00:06:30.400 --> 00:06:32.160 We had a bishop who visited one time. 00:06:32.160 --> 00:06:32.880 He was he was home. 00:06:32.880 --> 00:06:37.120 He said, you know, without the fall, there'd be no need for a psychologist or a therapist. 00:06:37.120 --> 00:06:37.280 Right? 00:06:37.280 --> 00:06:43.775 And that and we never, you know, call things by their appropriate for a priest. 00:06:43.775 --> 00:06:46.175 There'd be no need well, that wouldn't be that. 00:06:46.175 --> 00:06:48.355 We you'd be be be a be a lot different. 00:06:48.415 --> 00:06:48.815 Yeah. 00:06:48.815 --> 00:07:04.140 And so, so, how do you see I know you you have a great experience of integration and much experience in psychology and also working with priests, and the spiritual aspect of it. 00:07:05.395 --> 00:07:07.635 It's kinda hard for a priest to be a psychologist. 00:07:07.635 --> 00:07:11.655 It's kinda hard for a psychologist to be a spiritual expert. 00:07:12.515 --> 00:07:13.475 What do you recommend? 00:07:13.475 --> 00:07:22.250 Like, we we tried to do some things at DMU to get cooperation between priest, spiritual directors, and I'm sorry, counselors and psychologists. 00:07:22.950 --> 00:07:25.990 How do you see that and and any suggestions to make that? 00:07:25.990 --> 00:07:26.150 No. 00:07:26.150 --> 00:07:27.110 I think that's tremendous. 00:07:27.110 --> 00:07:33.850 I I think it's important for both to have some understanding of the other so that they're not speaking cross language. 00:07:34.465 --> 00:07:49.445 But, yeah, there's a gift that the that the priest and the spiritual director has and there's a gift that the therapist counselors have and, you know, one starts at the human and integrates the spiritual, the other starts at the spiritual and integrates the human. 00:07:50.040 --> 00:08:05.995 So as we work with the priest, they're needing their own healing and as they get their healing, they're then able to know kind of an internal level how to communicate the spiritual into the human in a way that they've experienced. 00:08:06.135 --> 00:08:06.455 Yeah. 00:08:06.455 --> 00:08:06.695 Yeah. 00:08:06.695 --> 00:08:06.935 Yeah. 00:08:06.935 --> 00:08:07.975 And dealing with those wounds. 00:08:07.975 --> 00:08:08.215 Right? 00:08:08.215 --> 00:08:13.175 Because the sins can be forgiven, but they leave a mark. 00:08:13.175 --> 00:08:13.575 Right? 00:08:14.135 --> 00:08:16.775 Some of the god god forgives but nature never forgives. 00:08:16.775 --> 00:08:29.640 And so many times we walk around and really for grace to take its full impact, well, from more the psychological aspects of how we heal those wounds and that great it was like the calendar effect someone once called it. 00:08:29.640 --> 00:08:29.880 Right? 00:08:29.880 --> 00:08:35.105 The grace just kinda I get forgiven but I come back with the same sin all the time. 00:08:35.105 --> 00:08:36.545 I can't break this bad habit. 00:08:36.545 --> 00:08:38.385 Well, we gotta kinda heal that nature too. 00:08:38.385 --> 00:08:38.885 Right? 00:08:39.025 --> 00:08:45.445 One of the things we have in our teaching, you know, how Jesus uses the tree and getting to the roots of the tree all the way through. 00:08:45.665 --> 00:08:48.050 So we have an image of a tree. 00:08:48.270 --> 00:09:03.365 We have the sins up the top as a tree and then we have the the deadly sin at the trunk of the tree and then the ungodly self reliance which underlies the sin and then all the woundedness at the bottom underneath the ground. 00:09:03.365 --> 00:09:11.305 And so it's often the hidden aspect that we don't see but it keeps manifesting in the sun as it does as it does. 00:09:12.245 --> 00:09:28.410 So, for our students or aspiring students, who really wanna wanna be faithful Catholic professionals and really be but really do their scientific work well, based on your experience, what what would you what words would you have for them? 00:09:29.325 --> 00:09:35.805 Well, one is at John Paul the second's anthropology which I know the anthropology of John Paul the second Mhmm. 00:09:35.965 --> 00:09:38.625 Which I know is a core to to India. 00:09:39.485 --> 00:09:56.840 That is so foundational because if you don't have a right vision for who we are as human beings and and that theology of the body and everything that he's developed in terms of the human person is actually the great integration of the human and spiritual. 00:09:57.475 --> 00:09:58.775 So that is a foundation. 00:09:59.635 --> 00:10:02.855 Second thing is our prayer life and our sacramental life. 00:10:03.155 --> 00:10:10.515 If we're not doing that, then the knowledge puffs us up, Saint Paul says, rather than get build up. 00:10:10.515 --> 00:10:17.550 Then the third is our own healing journey, you know, that there's there's and and that Jesus is the center of that. 00:10:17.930 --> 00:10:27.665 Even in secular work, if Jesus is the center of that work and we allow the holy spirit to direct it, then we're not just rationalizing ourselves to it. 00:10:27.665 --> 00:10:30.085 We're allowing the transformation to take place. 00:10:30.305 --> 00:10:39.585 So understand, learn anthropology, be a man or woman of prayer, and put another crisis we put Christ at the center of all your work. 00:10:39.585 --> 00:10:39.905 Yeah. 00:10:39.905 --> 00:10:40.305 Yeah. 00:10:40.305 --> 00:10:40.950 Very good. 00:10:41.110 --> 00:10:41.350 Yeah. 00:10:41.350 --> 00:10:44.490 And well, thank you so much for being with us. 00:10:45.030 --> 00:10:53.430 Your thoughts, you I know you've mentioned a couple times of the anthropology we do have in your future DMU, and you didn't have that. 00:10:53.430 --> 00:10:59.675 And I know some people, you know, have done like you know, I was talking to someone the other day. 00:10:59.675 --> 00:11:06.815 You know, I actually, one of our faculty members went to very secular, so there's reason, but I had two friends and we just started doing it on our own. 00:11:07.275 --> 00:11:09.775 But we try to give people a shortcut at DMU. 00:11:09.835 --> 00:11:12.000 So, so it's never appreciated. 00:11:12.000 --> 00:11:12.240 Yeah. 00:11:12.240 --> 00:11:14.160 So so that that's kinda what we're trying to do. 00:11:14.160 --> 00:11:20.640 So just thank you for for for, being with us and, appreciate it. 00:11:20.640 --> 00:11:47.140 And any any words for our students as far as, you know, they're thinking about a career and, you know, you know, if you're not I think a lot of people who aren't we get a lot of former seminarians who are religious or religious sisters that focus missionaries who are kinda like, I want I don't I'm not called, right, to be a a priest or a missionary for my whole life, but I wanna help people on a deep level. 00:11:48.560 --> 00:11:50.720 I I can't think of a better field to do that. 00:11:50.720 --> 00:11:51.220 Yeah. 00:11:51.440 --> 00:11:53.060 It's it's been incredible. 00:11:53.520 --> 00:12:00.015 Just, there there are it's it can be taxing, so you really have to have self care. 00:12:00.395 --> 00:12:17.870 But you get into the depths of the human person's heart in a way that hardly anyone else does and that's why it's so important that we have that spiritual House and cleanness, you know, purity of heart that we're continually growing in. 00:12:18.090 --> 00:12:23.450 But, just it's a great, profession occupation, but it's more than that. 00:12:23.450 --> 00:12:24.510 It's a vocation. 00:12:25.065 --> 00:12:29.405 And so if you're called to that, just live it from your heart with Jesus. 00:12:30.265 --> 00:12:31.065 Thank you so much. 00:12:31.065 --> 00:12:37.385 Now you you've written so many great books and your your website, where would the people if they wanna get more information about the retreats and books and stuff? 00:12:37.385 --> 00:12:39.165 John Paul the second Healing Center. 00:12:39.465 --> 00:12:43.620 All the books are there, and restore the glory podcast. 00:12:43.680 --> 00:12:47.140 We have a lot of stuff that you can get download for free and listen. 00:12:47.360 --> 00:12:47.860 Absolutely. 00:12:48.000 --> 00:12:48.800 Well, thank you. 00:12:48.800 --> 00:12:51.440 Thank you, doctor Eric Schultz, and, great to talk to you. 00:12:51.440 --> 00:12:51.676 Thank you, Paul. 00:12:51.676 --> 00:12:53.296 God bless you. 00:12:55.836 --> 00:12:56.586 God bless.